New Dragon 2.5

I love it to see Stockfish beaten.

Mclane wrote:

I love it to see Stockfish beaten.

Unfortunately I did not see it
Gave Dragon white with time control of 1+1 and Dragon lost against almost the last version of stockfish.
I only change the default hash to 2048 mbytes so both engines got 2048 mbytes.



[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2021.09.24"]
[Round "?"]
[White "dragon-2.5-64bit-avx2"]
[Black "stockfish_21092119_x64_avx2(1 thread hash 2048) "]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "C02"]
[GameDuration "00:04:59"]
[GameEndTime "2021-09-24T23:14:50.332 שעון קיץ ירושלים"]
[GameStartTime "2021-09-24T23:09:50.606 שעון קיץ ירושלים"]
[Opening "French"]
[PlyCount "200"]
[TimeControl "60+1"]
[Variation "Advance, Euwe Variation"]

1. e4 {+0.67/21 2.2s} e6 {-0.37/28 6.4s} 2. d4 {+0.65/22 1.6s}
d5 {-0.52/27 1.3s} 3. e5 {+0.66/24 4.1s} c5 {-0.30/22 1.0s}
4. c3 {+0.66/24 2.0s} Nc6 {-0.45/24 2.5s} 5. Nf3 {+0.67/23 1.7s}
Bd7 {-0.40/24 1.3s} 6. a3 {+0.55/24 11s} c4 {-0.08/22 1.3s}
7. g3 {+0.46/21 1.8s} Na5 {-0.08/25 1.6s} 8. Nbd2 {+0.54/22 1.6s}
Qc7 {-0.07/24 1.7s} 9. h4 {+0.50/23 2.7s} Ne7 {-0.10/23 1.8s}
10. Rb1 {+0.55/22 2.0s} O-O-O {-0.17/25 3.5s} 11. Bh3 {+0.49/22 2.5s}
Kb8 {-0.11/25 2.8s} 12. Nf1 {+0.49/22 2.0s} h6 {0.00/20 0.97s}
13. Qe2 {+0.62/23 3.5s} a6 {0.00/25 5.3s} 14. N1h2 {+0.59/22 2.6s}
Nc8 {0.00/23 1.2s} 15. Bf4 {+0.63/23 3.0s} Be7 {-0.05/24 1.6s}
16. h5 {+0.60/22 1.4s} Ka7 {0.00/25 3.6s} 17. Ng4 {+0.70/21 2.4s}
Qb6 {-0.08/26 5.2s} 18. O-O {+0.70/21 2.0s} Rdg8 {0.00/24 1.6s}
19. Be3 {+0.62/23 2.3s} Be8 {0.00/27 3.5s} 20. Rbe1 {+0.63/23 2.6s}
Bd8 {0.00/26 1.2s} 21. Bc1 {+0.49/21 5.0s} Qc7 {0.00/29 10.0s}
22. Kh1 {+0.64/21 1.7s} Nb6 {0.00/25 2.2s} 23. Kh2 {+0.66/21 2.3s}
Na4 {0.00/23 0.99s} 24. Qc2 {+0.65/21 2.0s} Qb6 {0.00/26 1.4s}
25. Kg2 {+0.58/22 3.1s} Qb3 {0.00/26 1.4s} 26. Re2 {+0.64/20 0.96s}
Nb6 {0.00/24 1.6s} 27. Bf4 {+0.71/21 2.8s} Nd7 {0.00/28 6.5s}
28. Qd2 {+0.50/22 4.0s} Qb6 {0.00/26 0.91s} 29. Rfe1 {+0.42/21 3.2s}
Nf8 {+0.18/27 1.3s} 30. Kg1 {+0.43/19 1.5s} Nb3 {+0.46/22 3.2s}
31. Qd1 {+0.34/21 2.1s} Bc7 {+0.74/21 1.1s} 32. Be3 {+0.40/22 2.3s}
Nh7 {+0.73/21 1.5s} 33. Nd2 {0.00/20 0.84s} Nxd2 {+1.69/24 4.7s}
34. Qxd2 {-0.94/21 1.3s} f5 {+1.81/24 2.4s} 35. exf6 {-0.62/22 1.0s}
gxf6 {+1.75/21 0.64s} 36. Bxh6 {-0.69/23 1.1s} Bf7 {+1.95/21 1.0s}
37. Re3 {-0.54/23 1.4s} Qc6 {+1.95/19 0.83s} 38. a4 {-1.19/21 2.5s}
Qe8 {+2.04/20 1.0s} 39. Rf3 {-1.59/22 2.3s} Bd8 {+2.91/18 0.68s}
40. Nh2 {-1.87/23 1.3s} Qd7 {+2.50/22 1.8s} 41. Bg2 {-2.05/23 3.2s}
f5 {+2.95/21 0.75s} 42. Rfe3 {-2.11/21 1.1s} Nf6 {+3.15/23 1.4s}
43. Bf4 {-2.11/22 1.0s} Ne4 {+2.93/24 1.5s} 44. Rxe4 {-2.22/21 1.0s}
fxe4 {+3.06/22 0.57s} 45. g4 {-2.15/19 0.69s} Bxh5 {+3.08/24 0.94s}
46. gxh5 {-2.46/21 0.62s} Rxh5 {+3.15/21 0.65s} 47. Nf1 {-2.10/22 0.62s}
Qh7 {+3.16/22 1.3s} 48. Ng3 {-2.26/20 0.97s} Rh4 {+3.23/22 1.1s}
49. Re2 {-2.37/21 2.0s} Qd7 {+3.46/21 0.83s} 50. Nf1 {-2.52/21 1.0s}
Qxa4 {+3.65/19 0.77s} 51. Bg3 {-2.62/20 0.79s} Rhg4 {+3.89/19 0.80s}
52. Ne3 {-2.66/20 0.54s} R4g7 {+3.30/26 5.7s} 53. Kf1 {-2.79/21 0.78s}
Qd7 {+3.45/20 0.22s} 54. Ke1 {-3.01/21 0.83s} Bc7 {+3.41/20 0.53s}
55. Nf1 {-2.71/23 2.0s} Rf7 {+3.20/23 1.8s} 56. Qc1 {-2.61/20 0.79s}
Qe7 {+3.20/19 0.75s} 57. Qh6 {-2.55/20 0.82s} Rf6 {+3.65/19 0.60s}
58. Qc1 {-2.68/21 1.2s} Qf7 {+3.72/19 0.28s} 59. Qe3 {-2.64/21 0.40s}
Bxg3 {+3.71/18 0.41s} 60. fxg3 {-2.55/22 0.67s} Rf8 {+3.91/21 0.70s}
61. Nd2 {-2.53/21 0.51s} Qh5 {+3.97/23 1.2s} 62. Nf1 {-2.71/20 0.46s}
a5 {+4.07/25 2.3s} 63. Qg1 {-3.23/23 3.1s} Qg4 {+4.19/20 0.34s}
64. Kd2 {-3.39/21 1.1s} Qg6 {+4.76/21 1.7s} 65. Kc1 {-3.33/20 0.74s}
R6f7 {+4.64/20 0.54s} 66. Ne3 {-3.57/18 0.57s} Qxg3 {+5.42/23 0.80s}
67. Kb1 {-3.63/19 0.86s} Rf2 {+5.10/23 0.52s} 68. Qe1 {-4.45/19 0.40s}
Qf4 {+5.43/22 0.46s} 69. Nd1 {-4.19/23 2.0s} Rxe2 {+5.85/21 0.67s}
70. Qxe2 {-5.25/21 0.69s} Rg8 {+6.09/23 1.4s} 71. Kc2 {-5.95/22 1.7s}
Qg3 {+6.91/23 0.56s} 72. Ne3 {-6.61/21 1.0s} Rf8 {+7.04/25 0.80s}
73. Nd1 {-7.04/22 0.59s} Qd3+ {+7.38/27 4.5s} 74. Qxd3 {-7.38/21 0.53s}
cxd3+ {+7.37/22 0.26s} 75. Kd2 {-7.54/22 0.97s} b5 {+7.43/23 0.39s}
76. Bh3 {-6.86/20 1.0s} Rf6 {+7.46/22 0.46s} 77. Bg4 {-8.27/21 1.7s}
a4 {+7.52/21 0.43s} 78. Bh5 {-8.57/21 1.2s} Kb6 {+7.69/19 0.51s}
79. Ke3 {-8.87/22 0.69s} b4 {+8.01/20 0.74s} 80. cxb4 {-9.45/18 0.39s}
Kb5 {+8.36/19 0.53s} 81. Nf2 {-9.74/21 0.85s} Kxb4 {+8.39/21 0.57s}
82. Nd1 {-10.49/22 2.0s} Rh6 {+8.69/21 0.73s} 83. Bg4 {-10.73/20 0.43s}
Kb3 {+8.84/21 0.63s} 84. Kd2 {-11.78/20 0.73s} Rg6 {+9.69/23 0.91s}
85. Bh3 {-12.31/21 0.87s} Kc4 {+10.92/20 0.79s} 86. Ne3+ {-13.26/20 1.6s}
Kxd4 {+13.30/19 0.87s} 87. Bg4 {-13.81/21 1.4s} Rh6 {+16.06/20 0.69s}
88. Nf1 {-14.90/22 1.0s} e3+ {+61.48/33 0.78s} 89. Ke1 {-16.17/18 0.35s}
Rh1 {+83.63/36 0.85s} 90. Be2 {-17.25/20 1.6s} dxe2 {+M29/39 0.88s}
91. Kxe2 {-M36/16 0.18s} Rxf1 {+M25/41 1.0s} 92. Kxf1 {-M34/20 0.57s}
Kd3 {+M23/39 1.0s} 93. Kg2 {-M32/15 0.097s} e2 {+M17/38 0.99s}
94. Kf3 {-M28/17 0.11s} e1=Q {+M13/43 0.82s} 95. Kg4 {-M12/17 0.11s}
Qg1+ {+M11/51 0.79s} 96. Kf4 {-M10/23 0.11s} Qe3+ {+M9/102 0.80s}
97. Kg4 {-M8/5 0s} Ke4 {+M7/245 0.33s} 98. b4 {-M6/99 0.019s}
Qg1+ {+M5/245 0.032s} 99. Kh5 {-M4/99 0.007s} Kf5 {+M3/245 0.004s}
100. b5 {-M2/99 0.007s} Qh2# {+M1/245 0.002s, Black mates} 0-1

Mclane wrote:

I love it to see Stockfish beaten.

I would like to see another engine really challenge Stockfish, other then another Stockfish. But Dragon 2.5 is not the one.

And that is clear in less then 100 games.

Score of Dragon 2.5 vs Stockfish 23/09/21: 0 - 8 - 88 [0.458]
... Dragon 2.5 playing White: 0 - 2 - 46 [0.479] 48
... Dragon 2.5 playing Black: 0 - 6 - 42 [0.438] 48
... White vs Black: 6 - 2 - 88 [0.521] 96
Elo difference: -29.0 +/- 19.3, LOS: 0.2 %, DrawRatio: 91.7 %
96 of 1000 games finished.

mwyoung wrote:

Mclane wrote:

I love it to see Stockfish beaten.

I would like to see another engine really challenge Stockfish, other then another Stockfish. But Dragon 2.5 is not the one.

And that is clear in less then 100 games.

Score of Dragon 2.5  vs Stockfish 23/09/21: 0 - 8 - 88 [0.458]
...      Dragon 2.5  playing White: 0 - 2 - 46  [0.479] 48
...      Dragon 2.5  playing Black: 0 - 6 - 42  [0.438] 48
...      White vs Black: 6 - 2 - 88  [0.521] 96
Elo difference: -29.0 +/- 19.3, LOS: 0.2 %, DrawRatio: 91.7 %
96 of 1000 games finished.

I agree
10-0 and 119 draws is a bad result.
I wonder if it is possible to get some wins against stockfish even at the price of losses and get something like 100-5 with 24 draws.

Can we get some wins for dragon by the armagaddon setting in the same conditions or maybe even this is not going to help?

Elo points are not the only important thing about engines. I like the Komodo series. The levels implemented in Komodo 12 are excellent for sparring, and I like the evaluation, especially of K8 and K9. In fact, Komodo 9 is my new favourite engine: he is positionally sound and tactically better than K8. Lately, I simultaneously use K9 and SC 2.7 to better understand what NNs bring to the eval -- and to improve my understanding of the game, of course.

I really don't see the point of running endless eng-eng matches and looking at the score, especially when the thing that makes the most difference seems to be the search. But then, what do I know...